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gbkubfan
08-02-2019, 02:10 AM
Well it is 3 months before the November shipping date for Legacy. Thank goodness my birthday is in September. I am hinting at gift cards so I can get FUN, Legacy and Triple Live. I need 1 full 3 box set for my collection, 2 regular single boxes ( 1 rareties and 1 regular one). I need 2 FUN (unless special edition, then 4). And 12 copies of Triple Live (unless there is special edition, then 14). Plus any bundles. I wonder if their is any other configuration. Going to be an expensive Fall but worth it. That doesn't count gifts for Christmas.

garthcop
08-02-2019, 06:23 AM
It's going to be a great season to be a Garth fan!

rhd13
08-02-2019, 12:00 PM
I want to be excited, I really do, but I am just struggling to understand how this is all going to work. Is he really going to release 3-4 products in the span of a couple of months? From a fan perspective that is exciting, but just by definition things are really going to get lost in the shuffle for the general public (which is not us on this board). Obviously, we are getting the Legacy vinyl sets and he says we are getting Triple Live and Fun. If all that comes out at once I have to believe there will be some sort of Triple Live/Fun bundle (with one of the limited covers being a part of that bundle no doubt). If that is the case it once again diminishes the new studio record. I just don't get that. I'm not fully convinced it's all coming by the end of the year. It's not like Triple Live and Fun haven't both been delayed. It's going to be a year and a half between pre-ordering Fun and getting it and about that long before we actually get the completed Triple Live with all the tracks.

Also, what about the next edition of the Anthology? I think it's safe to say that's not coming this year. Where are the DVDs that were supposedly part of the documentary that was going to be a part of Anthology?

I just feel like the whole release schedule doesn't make sense other than the fact it is all about holidays, big box retailers, bundles, and padding RIAA numbers.

Again, not trying to be cynical. I actually want to be excited, but I was excited about Triple Live and Fun a year and a half ago. After waiting so long it is hard to maintain that enthusiasm. I've planned and gone on a European vacation in significantly less time than that this year HA!

I'm also not encouraged by the pics we saw on Amazon of the new vinyl set. Are the bonus tracks on the CDs seriously going to be the songs that were on the original Limited Series released in 1998 (ie. songs we've had for 21 years now)?

gbkubfan
08-02-2019, 01:18 PM
I totally agree with you. It is all so confusing. But hopefully in the end we will be happy. I am just looking forward to my quest. :-)

Skywise
08-02-2019, 03:17 PM
Well it is 3 months before the November shipping date for Legacy. Thank goodness my birthday is in September. I am hinting at gift cards so I can get FUN, Legacy and Triple Live. I need 1 full 3 box set for my collection, 2 regular single boxes ( 1 rareties and 1 regular one). I need 2 FUN (unless special edition, then 4). And 12 copies of Triple Live (unless there is special edition, then 14). Plus any bundles. I wonder if their is any other configuration. Going to be an expensive Fall but worth it. That doesn't count gifts for Christmas.
gbkubfan I'm not gonna slam you for your collecting, I understand in some ways (heck I'm getting the vinyl collection w/ no plans on ever opening it) and I used to be one who would think about a lot of diff. version etc (even though I kinda got out of that way of thinking around the time double live was re-released with diff covers yet again (have it on first edition, and anniversary edition..) but- man- that's a lot of re-re-re buying things!



I want to be excited, I really do, but I am just struggling to understand how this is all going to work. Is he really going to release 3-4 products in the span of a couple of months? From a fan perspective that is exciting, but just by definition things are really going to get lost in the shuffle for the general public (which is not us on this board). certainly- Garth wants the 'casual fans' to come on board but they won't be flocking to all the releases all the time-


Obviously, we are getting the Legacy vinyl sets and he says we are getting Triple Live and Fun. If all that comes out at once I have to believe there will be some sort of Triple Live/Fun bundle (with one of the limited covers being a part of that bundle no doubt). I'm sure there will be some sort of bundle, unless Garth has learned for his mistake (what else can you call it) of bundling gunslinger w/ target in the box set etc.. (after seeing so many on clearance shelves).
If that is the case it once again diminishes the new studio record. I just don't get that. I'm not fully convinced it's all coming by the end of the year. It's not like Triple Live and Fun haven't both been delayed. It's going to be a year and a half between pre-ordering Fun and getting it and about that long before we actually get the completed Triple Live with all the tracks. garth does like to hype then stretch out release times certainly...


]Also, what about the next edition of the Anthology? I think it's safe to say that's not coming this year. Where are the DVDs that were supposedly part of the documentary that was going to be a part of Anthology? I guess it depends on what version of the anthology is coming out next? :) is it vol. 2? vol. 4? vol 5? an unannounced TY centric 'vol 6'? :)

I'd like to see the next version of the anthology but will there be any buzz? on a casual fan level?


I just feel like the whole release schedule doesn't make sense other than the fact it is all about holidays, big box retailers, bundles, and padding RIAA numbers.
DING! another eye opened!

I agree, doesn't all make sense.. I wonder sometimes if Garth says things he can't back up, or really IS as clueless as he sometimes lets on.. (is it less of an act than we're thinking?)


Again, not trying to be cynical. I actually want to be excited, but I was excited about Triple Live and Fun a year and a half ago. After waiting so long it is hard to maintain that enthusiasm. I've planned and gone on a European vacation in significantly less time than that this year HA! just remember this- there were those of us (you may be one, Ryan I don't know ) who had to listen to the 'we're announcing our retirement to go home to oklahoma' phase, the 'dead air phase' of garth being garth in ok, and raising the kids.. Granted as I've said before I understand WHY he did what he did but the retirement was a debacle from the beginning from a music standpoint.. there were 13-14 years between scarecrow and MAM.... really? what's a few more months?



I'm also not encouraged by the pics we saw on Amazon of the new vinyl set. Are the bonus tracks on the CDs seriously going to be the songs that were on the original Limited Series released in 1998 (ie. songs we've had for 21 years now)?
yeah- I'm still getting the vinyl, but i'm gonna be rather pissed if Garth has been lying essentially about bonus songs.. if it's the same 21 year old crap that's been released and re-released.. it's gonna be a slap to the face of the 'smart' fan..... (to use a wrestling term)

Emerald Isle
08-02-2019, 04:22 PM
I have no doubt we'll see FUN this fall alongside the Legacy set and maybe a standalone Triple Live. I don't think he minds one bit sacrificing the hype for FUN to the higher-possible-RIAA potential of Legacy.

I mean, it's already clear at this point that Garth's chief focus with regard to product this year is the 42-units-per-sale Legacy set, and not the 1-unit-per-sale FUN album. The Legacy artwork is all you see at his pre-concert press-conferences, it's what he focuses on when he talks about new product coming this year on ISG, and while it was presumably the last thing started (between Triple Live, Fun, and Legacy) it was the first thing he finished and set for pre-order on Amazon.

If you were to ask Garth which of the three products he would want you to buy this year if you had pick only one, I think it's a no brainer that he'd say the Legacy set. In his mind, that's a 14-42 unit sale and helps 3 albums potentially get to Diamond status, whereas the standalone Triple Live set will only be 3 units per sale, and the standalone Fun album will only be 1 unit per sale, and there's little to no hope of either one of those EVER reaching Diamond status. Even if they bundle Triple Live and FUN, that's still only a 4-unit sale. No, Garth's focus is 100% on the Legacy set. FUN is nothing more than a nice also-ran in his priorities.

But hold your horses, 'cause next year you can bet your booties that Legacy 2 is on its way.

Brett Dale
08-02-2019, 06:31 PM
Legacy is released on November 1. Im 99% sure that the version of Triple Live in the Legacy will be the Fan Mix. No extra songs.

The bonus songs on the other albums will be the same as The Limited Series.

Stand alone Triple Live will NOT be released this year.

The Doco on his tour, will NOT be released this year.

Fun will be released Late November, it will contain ten songs.

In 2020 The Stand Alone Triple Live will be released there will be six extra songs on it that weren't on the Legacy.

There will be a bundle with Fun in 2020, and Fun will include a couple of extra songs.

For myself, I am excited about Fun!! Also cant wait to get a physical copy of Triple Live.

Skywise
08-02-2019, 06:46 PM
hmm- ok, answering some of the speculation....


Legacy is released on November 1. Im 99% sure that the version of Triple Live in the Legacy will be the Fan Mix. No extra songs dont think it'll be fan mix, but maybe the normal mix that came out already in the anthology.


The bonus songs on the other albums will be the same as The Limited Series. I'm thinking this is accurate, and a really crappy thing for Garth to do his fan base as the songs aren't bonus at all they have been available for 20 years or more


Stand alone Triple Live will NOT be released this year. not anything w/ added/changed songs perhaps- depending on all the recording that's being done at shows... Garth recorded Much Too Young in Denver I know specifically for TL so there's that...


The Doco on his tour, will NOT be released this year. Is the Doc on his TOUR specifically? It's a 4 part thing by A&E and they have to announce/prep things in advance, so I'm still thinking that's a poss. for broadcast


Fun will be released Late November, it will contain ten songs. I'll say 12.. but otherwise, I think NOV is a good timeframe unfortunately.


In 2020 The Stand Alone Triple Live will be released there will be six extra songs on it that weren't on the Legacy. that would make sense w/ the tour perhaps, dep. on shows being performed before then- after all, he's gonna be taking the fall off apparently with TY being on tour


There will be a bundle with Fun in 2020, and Fun will include a couple of extra songs. I'd see more likely that any extra songs would be on a ltd series release it seems to fit Garth's MO


For myself, I am excited about Fun!! Also cant wait to get a physical copy of Triple Live.
lol if you have the anthology you already have a physical TL (of sorts).... but I'm anticipating fun.. but sadly, being prepped to feel ripped off and lied to as well, w/ the 'bonus songs' on legacy....

gbkubfan
08-02-2019, 06:57 PM
I think Garth wants to end his 30th year with at least 3 more Diamond Awards, ship 52 million plus to hit 200 million, sell 26 million copies to hit 100 million on Soundscan, plus make No Fences the number 1 selling country album. Pretty big goals and I think he could be close. He really hasn't certified most of his albums since 2006. So he has the bundle he had when he did his web thing, he has his presale of FUN, he has Legacy, he has Triple Live. Plus he was really pushing The Chase and In Pieces to sell. And Christmas Together hasn't been certified. Lots of numbers for RIAA purposes. And if he can get the sales of this next few months over 26 million. Hmmmmmm......I can see a marketing campaign designed around Legacy with hear the new music and get a taste of a Garth concert with Triple Live. I am surprised he doesn't do a concert bundle since so many other artists are hitting #1 with their ticket cd bundles.

Skywise
08-02-2019, 07:00 PM
....I am surprised he doesn't do a concert bundle since so many other artists are hitting #1 with their ticket cd bundles.

Garth doesn't tend to do "what other artists do".. he never has.. I doubt he ever will...

gbkubfan
08-02-2019, 07:08 PM
I know but he should think about it if he wants to hit his goals. Can't hurt. Can you imagine how many copies of Triple Live could have been sold if he bundled them with tickets to the stadium tour. Or even get FUN top loaded with a bundle. He could have pre sold FUN like he did with presales at Amazon and really sold the crap out of FUN. Which brings up another question. Does being on Amazon going to helpsales for Garth or just a good thing for Amazon?

rhd13
08-03-2019, 09:54 AM
Back in the late 90s I thought the chase to run up the RIAA sales list and try to catch Elvis and the Beatles was a lot of fun. Garth was a HUGE, active artist selling boat loads of albums. Now with all the bundles, exclusive retail deals, selling us 3 box sets with a combined 42 units, etc. has just taken the fun out of catching the Beatles. If he surpasses the Beatles those who know how the counting works are going to look at his numbers the same way people look at the MLB home run numbers of the 90s. They are inflated and a fair minded person knows it. I would love him to catch the Beatles, but this whole Legacy bundle of 42 units in one sale kind of takes the fun out of that chase in my mind.

gbkubfan
08-03-2019, 12:26 PM
It is amazing how numbers are skewered nowadays. I mean, an album sale can be made with a certain amount of downloads or stream of 1 song. Play a certain song x number of times equals 1 album sale. Ed Sheeren now has the top tour ever beating U2 but we all know Garth supposedly has the record but didn't allow Billboard to see numbers. I can't blame Garth for manipulating the numbers to help him with RIAA numbers. To the casual fan, all they will heaar is 200 million sold. Much like the Elvis Preseley album from the 60's boasting 50 million records sold. But he does have thee numbers on soundscan with 74 million sold since soundscan started keeping tabs. I hope that when he hits his goals that he will quit messing with numbers and concentrate on music. Don't get me wrong. I am a collector and love new product but I do love Garth and his music and love new music. But part of me wants to see Garth sings the George Strait songbook and similar albums like they released in 60's and 70's.

rhd13
08-03-2019, 01:09 PM
It is amazing how numbers are skewered nowadays. I mean, an album sale can be made with a certain amount of downloads or stream of 1 song. Play a certain song x number of times equals 1 album sale. Ed Sheeren now has the top tour ever beating U2 but we all know Garth supposedly has the record but didn't allow Billboard to see numbers. I can't blame Garth for manipulating the numbers to help him with RIAA numbers. To the casual fan, all they will heaar is 200 million sold. Much like the Elvis Preseley album from the 60's boasting 50 million records sold. But he does have thee numbers on soundscan with 74 million sold since soundscan started keeping tabs. I hope that when he hits his goals that he will quit messing with numbers and concentrate on music. Don't get me wrong. I am a collector and love new product but I do love Garth and his music and love new music. But part of me wants to see Garth sings the George Strait songbook and similar albums like they released in 60's and 70's.

I totally get what you mean by talking about how the numbers are skewered. However, I think the RIAA had to do something and try to figure out a way to measure "consumption" of an album. In some ways the argument could be made that the measurements are more accurate now. I don't know about you, but I have bought many albums over the years that I listened to once or twice and never listened to again. While there are other albums that I wore completely out. From a raw sale perspective I bought each of those albums once, but my consumption of those albums is totally different. Streaming can measure those differences. It can tell you what people are actually listening to and not just what was bought and never listened to again.

Of course, the flip side to that is an actual sale generates a lot more money for the artist/label than a stream does. I think that is also part of the reason that 150 streams is equal to 1 sale. I'm sure the RIAA did a lot of research on that and that it wasn't just some arbitrary, random number they pulled out of the air.

As far as the Garth tour, if I'm not mistaken Garth actually did release the final numbers of his tour just not the weekly/monthly numbers. I was able to find that the tour grossed $364,300,000 over 390 shows and 6.4 million tickets sold. I'm pretty sure those are the correct final numbers. That is far and away the biggest country tour of all-time, but only 10th all-time according to gross. As far as tickets sold that would make it #3 all-time behind Ed Sheeran and U2.

You may be right that the casual fan will hear 200 million sold and be fine with that. However, I think even some casual fans will question if he is really the best selling artist of all-time. I've got friends who are pretty casual music listeners who understand some of the RIAA rules and Garth's manipulation of it. I just think the mad dash to pass the Beatles is watering it down and I still believe those who understand it will look at it with an asterik if he beats it. It's not a good look to sell sets that counts as 42 units when it is really just one purchase.

I agree with you that I wish it was about the music again. I think the bundles and sets wouldn't feel like a desperate attempt to pad RIAA numbers if it wasn't for the fact that we are getting them every year, and with very little bonus material the loyal fan wants.
I just think there is a more natural feeling way to increase the numbers that would make it all feel more legit if/when he does end up becoming the best selling artist of all-time.

My question would be what is wrong with being the #2 best selling artist of all-time behind only the Beatles? What's wrong with being, far and away, the best selling country artist of all-time? I feel like sometimes the desperate attempt to pass the Beatles just doesn't look good when done the way he is going about it.

rhd13
08-03-2019, 02:28 PM
I was thinking about this today, but I know some have mentioned that several of his albums haven't been certified since 2006 and that there are tons of units unaccounted for in the certifications since it has been 13 years. I don't think that is the case at all. Think about it, after 2006 his music was virtually impossible to find in physical form. The CDs weren't available in stores, you couldn't find him digitally. The music was non-existent on the market to buy. It wasn't until 2014 and GhostTunes that it became readily available digitally. (In some cases it's still not widely available in CD form.) I don't think he sold millions of copies on GhostTunes. I think a few thousand would be reasonable, but not millions.

I think it is clear based upon the way he's handled things lately that the units aren't there for the Diamond certifications. I am fully convinced this is why they ran the promotion giving away copies of The Chase and In Pieces (copies Amazon clearly bought). I think that is why instead of putting his first 4 albums in the Legacy Collection (which makes the most sense if there are going to be more vinyl sets) he put The Chase, In Pieces, and Fresh Horse (ie. the 3 albums closest to a Diamond certification). Of course, No Fences is getting closer to Double Diamond and it will always be the biggest selling point for a set like that.

I think the more interesting certification points are Ropin' and In Pieces. Those haven't been certified since 1998 and I do think there could be more units of those out there unaccounted for.

Again, we can't forget it all depends on how you certify because it can be done two different ways. You can certify each individual album in a set OR you can certify the set as a whole. Since I think he is desperately trying to get some of these albums to Diamond he's going to certify them individually not as a set. That's why I don't think the GhostTunes bundle was certified as it's own thing. He's holding on to those individual units to get the actual albums certified later, not the set. Again, I still don't think those could have sold more than a few thousand, not millions.

I think there is one other thing people are not thinking about. There are several HUGE Beatles albums that haven't been recertified since the late 90s/early 2000s. Just a few examples. Abbey Road was last certified in 2001, Sgt. Pepper's was 1997, Rubber Soul 1997, Revolver 2000, several greatest hits collections were 2001 and 2010. If Garth passes them and it becomes a huge news story I would almost guarantee that they will recertify once again. This is no offense to Garth, but I'd bet good money that those classic albums have moved more units since their last certification than Garth's albums since their last certification. My point is he could make this huge push, pass the Beatles and they could probably drop 30-50 million units at the drop of a hat because pretty much their entire catalog is undercertified.

gbkubfan
08-03-2019, 06:47 PM
Great points. Playing a sort of devil's advocate on your last point. Garth still leads the soundscan numbers with 74 million copies sold (not certified) and Beatles are a few million behind. So in RIAA certifications they could pass Garth up if it happens but the soundscan numbers will depend on how new Beatles product do. The movie Yesterday helped sell around 10-15 thousand each week at beginning so it wasn't as lucrative as I thought. The soundscan is based on actual sales so Garth could jump ahead with the maybe 3 products coming out. Either way it will be fun to see what happens. Will Garth be the first over 200 million (RIAA), the first over 100 million (soundscan), the Diamond/double Diamond and the big question can he sell a million vinyl? This is like a sports rivalry. Who is the best. Thanks for the great thoughts. I wish he would release the numbers from Ghosttunes, Amazon etc. Since you seem to know your stuff, has streaming on Amazon had any effect on his sale numbers? If x number of streams equal one sale I wonder where he stands and will it help him change his mind and make his music more available.
I love PG for giving the fans this forum to discuss topics like this. It is fun to see opinions and thoughts on how Garth's music is doing. Some other Garth pages are cool to read but contain just photos of concerts and t-shirts etc. I like to discuss. But that could be the collector in me.

rhd13
08-04-2019, 06:06 PM
Great points. Playing a sort of devil's advocate on your last point. Garth still leads the soundscan numbers with 74 million copies sold (not certified) and Beatles are a few million behind. So in RIAA certifications they could pass Garth up if it happens but the soundscan numbers will depend on how new Beatles product do. The movie Yesterday helped sell around 10-15 thousand each week at beginning so it wasn't as lucrative as I thought. The soundscan is based on actual sales so Garth could jump ahead with the maybe 3 products coming out. Either way it will be fun to see what happens. Will Garth be the first over 200 million (RIAA), the first over 100 million (soundscan), the Diamond/double Diamond and the big question can he sell a million vinyl? This is like a sports rivalry. Who is the best. Thanks for the great thoughts. I wish he would release the numbers from Ghosttunes, Amazon etc. Since you seem to know your stuff, has streaming on Amazon had any effect on his sale numbers? If x number of streams equal one sale I wonder where he stands and will it help him change his mind and make his music more available.
I love PG for giving the fans this forum to discuss topics like this. It is fun to see opinions and thoughts on how Garth's music is doing. Some other Garth pages are cool to read but contain just photos of concerts and t-shirts etc. I like to discuss. But that could be the collector in me.

Great questions and to be honest with you I'm not sure I know all of the answers.

Yes, Garth does lead the Beatles in SoundScan numbers, but I always think it is so important to remember that the Beatles broke up 21 years prior to the first SoundScan numbers where SoundScan pretty much covers Garth's entire career other than the first couple of years. His astronomical 90s sales were definitely covered by the SoundScan era. To me this shows just how HUGE the Beatles are. They are 2nd only to Garth and SoundScan covered absolutely NONE of their career while they were active.

I suspect there are a lot of potential Beatles certs out there unaccounted for. Clearly they have sold a boat load of albums in the SoundScan era and not all of those albums are accounted for in the certs. Sgt. Pepper's has not been recertified in 22 years. Abbey Road hasn't been recertified in 18 years. Their "Red" greatest hits album hasn't been recertified in 18 years. I could go on and on, but you get the picture. This isn't even considering any potential certifications from streaming. I just checked out of curiosity and the Beatles are ranked #101 on Spotify right now. This for a band that hasn't been active in 49 years!!!! I have to believe albums of that stature, by a band of that stature, that haven't been recertified in about 2 decades are undercertified. If nothing else they have some certifications due from just streaming I would think.


Last year the Beatles released a remixed version of their classic "White Album". Shortly after release they had it recertified and it jumped from 19 times platinum to 24 times platinum. I think it is reasonable to think there are several others in their catalog due for that kind of jump.